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[Issue] Minmatar capitals are terrible

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.06.20 15:07:00 - [1] Edited by: Asterisk Grat on 20/06/2008 15:07:32 Agree with the topic of this thread. I didn't look into the proposed high, meds, lows layouts, but Minmatar caps need more "useful" boosts. Naglfar isn't the best damage dealer anymore, not the best tanker. It can do both, but not great at it. Naglfar is still win when you look at it from "a dread is better than no dread". If Naglfar gets more damage boost = more called as primary. I'd like to see 7.5% shield boost bonus per level. And 3 turrent slots with 7.5% rate of fire bonus. This would move it out to maelstrom platform, from split system of typhoon platform, and make more useful. Now, if you want really want it to kick ass, give it 4 turrent slots Nidhoggur, is a logistics carrier, but whatever bonuses it gets doesn't make it a KICK ass logistic carrier. If it was boosted to be a better logistic carrier it would be primary, means that it needs a better tank. edited to give support to this thread.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.06.20 15:21:00 - [2] Nidhoggur How to make it a kick ass logistic carrier. -50% capital shield and armor transfer range per level -(Boost)15% bonus to shield and armor transfer amount per level. Bonus: 30 to 50% to all armor resistances This way, it can actually do some kick ass repping, fit cap recharger in the mids, and decently armor tank because it will be called primary.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.06.26 17:13:00 - [3] Originally by: Bane Glorious I was hoping to just fit this into my "Capital Ships Online" topic, but unfortunately that got voted down for the Iceland meeting. However, I will try to push this issue forward for the August meeting. I would prefer to label it as balance between dreads/carriers within their classes, however. That'd be great. Can you possibly give us an outline, more specifically how this will be prestented at the august meeting.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.07.02 14:17:00 - [4] Edited by: Asterisk Grat on 02/07/2008 14:17:05 Originally by: Nullshadow Edited by: Nullshadow on 30/06/2008 19:31:56 ...OTOH from a lore perspective I think that the Minmatar capitals should remain weaker overall. The Minmatar have only been free of the Amarr for 125 years now, and as such all of our ship designs are at most a couple of centuries old. By contrast the other races have been working on their ship designs for millenia; There is always a place for industrial espeinage and stolen trade secrets ;-)
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.08.20 13:44:00 - [5] When is the next meeting?
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.15 17:02:00 - [6] Bane, is this something you'd want to discuss at the next CSM/CCP meeting? http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=886168
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.15 17:06:00 - [7] or let me ask another question, be this topic on the discussion list or not for the next meeting with CCP, do we still get a review & response from CCP after the meeting? tnx
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.15 19:40:00 - [8] good news then, hopefully they will do something. I think i misread the other topic for being the actual meeting w/ ccp.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.26 17:47:00 - [9] Originally by: StoreSlem you fit your naglfar with crap and then complain it sucks? gtfo Hmm, please do show us your fitting, except you're a minmatar speced pilot, who flys amarr capitals. This only proves that minmatar caps suck. I was very temped to train for amarr capitals myself, but decided to stay true with minmatar, even though they suck, role playing kinda thing.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.27 14:03:00 - [10] Originally by: Yorda No he's right, with faction damage mods and a faction co-proc (about another ~200mil in gear) you can shove a DCII as well. You can also drop two faction gyro's for t2 and use a 3% cpu implant. You still need a cpu mod to fit a shield tank, your damage is still subpar, and your tank is ridiculously cap unstable but it is marginally better. I agree with you on the faction mods, and that's comparing apples to oranges. Compare other dreads fitted with faction mods, naglfar doesn't shine again. Originally by: Yorda I just don't think you should require a capital to spend millions more on an already crappy ship to make it marginally less subpar. Right ON! + more training time. Prop goes to you for starting this great thread.

Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.29 16:53:00 - [11] Response from CCP: 15. 0102-04-0045 Buff Minmatar Capital Ships This will be part of the capital ships review. If CCP identifies issues with the Minmatar ships then these will be addressed at that time.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.29 17:02:00 - [12] Pretty disappointing response imo, because there is no recognition. Still some hope though.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.12.23 20:05:00 - [13] Originally by: Triest There's no point in bumping it. The topic has already been mentioned to CCP, they've done their typical 'we might look at it, maybe' response, and that's that. CSM have done their job (such as it is), and now we wait a couple years for CCP to actually do something themselves. If they want to. I suggest we employ a CSM member to revive this topic in form of a follow up with CCP to provide us with more details at the very least. CSM members, sign up button is that way
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.01.07 16:47:00 - [14] CSM members, stop slacking, we have a job for you.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.01.20 02:29:00 - [15] Edited by: Asterisk Grat on 20/01/2009 02:30:35 Edited by: Asterisk Grat on 20/01/2009 02:30:23 Last I heard CCP is giving out Minmatar Dreadnaught skill books for free every other Monday and Wednesday. /end sarcasm
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.01.30 15:30:00 - [16] Originally by: Yorda I kinda wanna change the OP to Fix the Nag, Hel, and Ragnarok instead of nidhoggur + nag cuz I like the nidhoggur. It's a great ship as long as you suicide fit it with triage and 4 remote reps. The rest of them suck though. I guess the rag is okay as long as you dont care about gang bonuses. It's a shame the lev does everything it does but better though. I think that will kinda ruin the voting that took place in this thread. As for this thread my guess it is is to hope CCP finally notices it, and does recognize the problem. Basically, their response has ZERO sense of satisfaction to it. It can be translated into: Even though we don't recognize what you're talking about, but when we do capital ships review we may look at it and when that might be we can't tell you.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.02.28 23:02:00 - [17] Originally by: Yorda I can not think of a SINGLE (logical, looks dont count) reason anyone would want to train for a naglfar. Yet, we're here, I should have one coming out from an oven in 3 weeks. I know it's the worst dread. I was talking with a corp mate few day ago, he shield tanks his naglfar and 4 damage mods in the lows to stay competitive. His position on numerous POS kill mails was far from the top of the list. And thats what 4 damage mods and compromised tank. - Nid is armor tank - Thats about 18-20days of training time to be able to use capital shield booster for comparative damage with dam mods. - Another 15-17days of training time for split weapon system. We're not talking about regular skills needed for split weapon of a typhoon for example, we're talking capitals skills. This is a bad joke. Needless to say I'm still going minmatar all the way. I doubt I'd be spending extra time to be able to shield tank it, because split weapon system is enough.
Asterisk Grat Best Path Inc. Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2009.03.06 16:05:00 - [18] Originally by: Mestoth Anyone that suggests using an armour tank on this is crazy...the thing does negligable DPS WITH the 4 DMG mods...dont take them away!? I've been playing around some naglfar fits on SISI, and I now agree that armor tank on naglar is a bad idea for damage output. It's like having 3/4 of a dread, for same price as others and longer training time. (I think Armor tank can be good for pos bashing, if you're primary by pos, gives you more chances to survive, only it's tank is still subpar to other dreads) I thought about the term CCP has used for description as VERSATILE. Comparison: Amarr: Dread & Carrier: Armor Tank - 1 Weapon System Caldari: Dread & Carrier: Shield Tank - 1 Weapon System Gallente: Dread & Carrier: Armor Tank - 1 Weapon System Minmatar: Carrier - Armor Tank; Dread - Shield Tank. - 2 Weapon Systems Capital Shield Booster - 27 Days Tactical Shield Manipulation V, Shield Operation V, Capital Shield Operation VI - 27 Days Citadel - Torpedoes 5, Warhead Upgrades IV, Citadel Torpedoes IV - 26 Days VERSATILE costs minmatar capitals over 50 days of extra training time. Armor tank = still subpar tank, 3/4 of damage output compared to other dreads. Shield tank = More competitive damage, ok buffer tank, weak shield tank. Forced split weapons system layout = not much advantage in terms of damage. To sum it up, I think all this versatility and extra training time, doesn't give much advantage to minmatar capitals at all. It doesn't even bring it equal to performance to other capitals.

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